AINTREE GRAND NATIONAL 2025
- Thread starter rbtblb82
- Start date
Updated list below... what annoys me is, why is there so many Gordon Elliott/Gigginstown Stud horses in there, especially when they've run it 3/4/5 times before and never had a chance, they don't have a chance now, and why so many 10, 11, and 13! year olds! As if they have a chance. Yes, lets fill the field with naff horses that are over 10 and have no chance, but Mr Vango etc. don't get in, disgusting.
Not only should each trainer be limited to a max of 3 horses, maybe even 2, but each horse should be limited to 3 runs, once you've had 3 tries at the national you're out and can't run in it anymore, plus, horses over 10 should be excluded, that would make it a far better race.
I added a column for previous odds so you can see the odds changes.
Biggest movers so far are Hewick, Minella Cocooner, Minella Indo, Hyland and Senior Chief.
Not only should each trainer be limited to a max of 3 horses, maybe even 2, but each horse should be limited to 3 runs, once you've had 3 tries at the national you're out and can't run in it anymore, plus, horses over 10 should be excluded, that would make it a far better race.
| Horse Name | Odds | Previous Odds | Age | Wgt. | Form | Trainer | Owner | Prize £ | Wins | VDW |
| I Am Maximus | 6/1 | 8/1 | 9 | 11-12 | 4311P8 | W P Mullins | J P McManus | £810,783.00 | 6 | 135 |
| Iroko | 7/1 | 8/1 | 7 | 10-11 | 522F42 | Greenall & Guerriero | J P McManus | £62,402.00 | 4 | 16 |
| Stumptown | 8/1 | 10/1 | 8 | 11-2 | 3U1111 | G P Cromwell | Furze Bush | £125,003.00 | 8 | 16 |
| Hewick | 10/1 | 25/1 | 10 | 11-7 | 232571 | J J Hanlon | T J McDonald | £568,567.00 | 11 | 52 |
| Percival Legallois | 10/1 | 14/1 | 8 | 10-12 | 286411 | G P Cromwell | J P McManus | £213,625.00 | 6 | 36 |
| Vanillier | 11/1 | 14/1 | 10 | 10-6 | 0P6913 | G P Cromwell | H M Keaveney | £85,411.00 | 4 | 21 |
| Minella Cocooner | 12/1 | 40/1 | 9 | 10-5 | 315894 | W P Mullins | David Bobbet | £188,288.00 | 5 | 38 |
| Intense Raffles | 12/1 | 6/1 | 7 | 10-10 | 111902 | Thomas Gibney | Simon Munir | £298,233.00 | 6 | 50 |
| Minella Indo | 14/1 | 50/1 | 12 | 11-3 | 144326 | H De Bromhead | Barry Maloney | £473,286.00 | 8 | 59 |
| Hyland | 16/1 | 33/1 | 8 | 10-6 | 141122 | Nicky Henderson | Ten From Seven | £78,573.00 | 7 | 11 |
| Kandoo Kid | 20/1 | 20/1 | 9 | 10-11 | 2P2318 | Paul Nicholls | M Geoghegan | £176,654.00 | 4 | 44 |
| Meetingofthewaters | 20/1 | 20/1 | 8 | 10-7 | U37008 | W P Mullins | J P McManus | £116,098.00 | 4 | 29 |
| Beauport | 22/1 | 33/1 | 9 | 11-1 | P1P132 | N Twiston-Davies | B & P Burrough | £198,176.00 | 6 | 33 |
| Three Card Brag | 22/1 | 33/1 | 8 | 10-5 | 233713 | Gordon Elliot | McNeil Family | £29,452.00 | 4 | 7 |
| Nick Rockett | 25/1 | 14/1 | 8 | 11-8 | 273411 | W P Mullins | S & S Andrew | £107,122.00 | 6 | 18 |
| Grangeclare West | 25/1 | 50/1 | 9 | 11-8 | 11P625 | W P Mullins | Cheveley Park | £82,147.00 | 5 | 16 |
| Senior Chief | 28/1 | 40/1 | 8 | 10-10 | 21P169 | H De Bromhead | Lucky In Life | £75,146.00 | 4 | 19 |
| Monbeg Genius | 33/1 | 25/1 | 9 | 10-6 | 35P241 | Jonjo O'Neill | Wasdell | £50,329.00 | 6 | 8 |
| Bravemansgame | 40/1 | 40/1 | 10 | 11-0 | 562383 | Paul Nicholls | Bryan Drew | £341,223.00 | 9 | 38 |
| Threeunderthrufive | 40/1 | 50/1 | 10 | 10-12 | 221032 | Paul Nicholls | McNeil Family | £181,739.00 | 10 | 18 |
| Twig | 40/1 | 50/1 | 10 | 10-5 | 252P77 | Ben Pauling | Georgia Morgan | £68,958.00 | 7 | 10 |
| Fil Dor | 50/1 | 50/1 | 7 | 10-9 | 212433 | Gordon Elliot | RobCor | £81,434.00 | 6 | 14 |
| Stay Away Fay | 50/1 | 50/1 | 8 | 10-9 | 13PPP0 | Paul Nicholls | Bell & Lyons | £142,456.00 | 4 | 36 |
| Duffle Coat | 50/1 | 100/1 | 8 | 10-4 | 352P4B | Gordon Elliott | R Stokes | £87,404.00 | 5 | 17 |
| Appreciate It | 66/1 | 66/1 | 11 | 11-2 | 325351 | W P Mullins | M A Masterson | £260,866.00 | 9 | 29 |
| Hitman | 66/1 | 100/1 | 9 | 11-1 | 283222 | Paul Nicholls | Alex Ferguson | £53,807.00 | 4 | 13 |
| Chantry House | 66/1 | 66/1 | 11 | 10-13 | 095515 | Nicky Henderson | J P McManus | £262,724.00 | 10 | 26 |
| Broadway Boy | 66/1 | 33/1 | 7 | 10-9 | 35324P | N Twiston-Davies | D M Proos | £112,462.00 | 6 | 19 |
| Horantzau d'Airy | 66/1 | 66/1 | 8 | 10-6 | F22999 | Michael Keady | Jim Gill | £28,865.00 | 4 | 7 |
| Favori De Champdou | 66/1 | 66/1 | 10 | 10-3 | F18331 | Gordon Elliott | Gigginstown | £77,472.00 | 7 | 11 |
| Conflated | 66/1 | 100/1 | 11 | 11-2 | U58708 | Gordon Elliott | Gigginstown | £258,691.00 | 7 | 37 |
| Idas Boy | 80/1 | 66/1 | 11 | 10-10 | F03106 | Richard Phillips | Doxen Dreamers | £88,837.00 | 4 | 22 |
| Coko Beach | 80/1 | 66/1 | 10 | 10-9 | U50029 | Gordon Elliott | Gigginstown | £193,152.00 | 7 | 28 |
| Shakem Uparry | 80/1 | 66/1 | 11 | 10-4 | 110F50 | Ben Pauling | Harry Redknapp | £146,265.00 | 5 | 29 |
| Fantastic Lady | 80/1 | 66/1 | 10 | 10-3 | 61423P | Nicky Henderson | Evan Hanbury | £80,425.00 | 5 | 16 |
| Royale Pegaille | 100/1 | 66/1 | 11 | 11-9 | 1F1P66 | Venetia Williams | Mrs S Ricci | £349,776.00 | 7 | 50 |
| Celebre DAllen | 100/1 | 100/1 | 13 | 10-6 | 145U41 | Philip Hobbs | Allan Sennet | £159,693.00 | 9 | 18 |
| Roi Mage | 100/1 | 100/1 | 13 | 10-4 | 2921576 | Patrick Griffin | D G Pryde | £370,469.00 | 11 | 34 |
I added a column for previous odds so you can see the odds changes.
Biggest movers so far are Hewick, Minella Cocooner, Minella Indo, Hyland and Senior Chief.
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What has happened to Intense Raffles, surprised he’s pushed to 12/1 probably the only value now in the race, Irish National winner the best trial. Still with Stumptown or his stablemate Percival Legallois.
I fully appreciate why people hold such views but it would be totally impractical and would most likely have legal implications, can't think there's any easy answers to this problem.
Currently they have 2 rules that I think are ripe for improvement, horse must have run in a chase in the current season and horse must have been placed 1st, 2nd, 3rd or 4th in a chase over 2m 7 1/2 furlongs lifetime.
Do away with these rules and replace with 1 simple rule.
horse must have been placed 1st or 2nd in a chase over 2m 7 1/2 furlongs or more since March the previous year.
Now they have only 34 runners they need to get rid of some of the more spuriously qualified horses infesting the race.
Do away with these rules and replace with 1 simple rule.
horse must have been placed 1st or 2nd in a chase over 2m 7 1/2 furlongs or more since March the previous year.
Now they have only 34 runners they need to get rid of some of the more spuriously qualified horses infesting the race.
gerry
Mare
There you go dont go down to far in weights if ground is running faster, first three home in top 4 weights.
pawras
Stallion
Why? I see it as being neither. Yes the big yards will complain to start with but so what basically.
The BHA sets the rules that they have to follow. I'd possibly set the limits on owners as well, I don't like to see what I see as races being bought by weight of numbers, it's neither good for the sport or punters.
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Yes i have always said it's bad for the sport when trainers and owners dominate but the question is how would manage the situation ?
If you can point out how it can be done i will read with interest, that's why we're on the hod afterall.
pawras
Stallion
Just simply enforce a rule that a trainer can't enter more than x runners in a race, what's so hard about that?
The big yards will bitch and complain , but so what, it means some of the better horses will leave their yards and the handful of super yards might dominate less or they might not.
Not even the handicappers fault anymore, he didn’t miss any of those Mullins horses 163, 167, 163.
I believe uncompetitive racing in U.K. is a factor, right from the start the Irish have 25 runner maiden hurdles and 16 runner beginners chases, in the U.K. it’s single file 4 runner races where they never have to learn anything, UK horses can not cope at all in races with more than 15 runners, they can‘t compete because they’ve never competed.
I believe uncompetitive racing in U.K. is a factor, right from the start the Irish have 25 runner maiden hurdles and 16 runner beginners chases, in the U.K. it’s single file 4 runner races where they never have to learn anything, UK horses can not cope at all in races with more than 15 runners, they can‘t compete because they’ve never competed.
pawras
Stallion
you would think the bha and uk trainers would take note of the points of difference between UK and IRE, but nahhh
Well yeah but how many ?
When would you need to enter ?
Let's say the number is 3 entries per trainer, by definition you would be restricting trade just because some trainers are more successful than others.
What about flat racing ? would we want to restrict A O'brien restricted to 3 derby entries ? He very often has 3 or more runners but they'll be horses yet to race that will be entered in the derby and who knows which ones will prove themselves in the next few weeks.
I'm no expert but i could quickly come up with plenty of questions that would need an answer to.
markfinn
Sire
and that's one too many - easy to restrict - just say 2 only that would spread the talent and lead to bigger more diverse fields - more competitive races - we never know who owns what, the other horses could easily be spread across more stables.
pawras
Stallion
I gave the numbers in my earlier post that you responded to.
The same rules would apply to flat and jumps.
Too right I'd restrict o'brien and anyone else ie in an 7-11 runner race no more than 2 entries.
It feels like you are over thinking it, you simply set the limits as I described to start with. If owners have to move horses to other yards rather than all gravitating to a handful then the limits are doing their job
It might be that what you really mean is 2 for the final decs stage but either way the more you consider it the more complicated it gets.
What's to stop Aiden using his wife's name to open up a second yard and then i presume there's a few family members.
The only point i'm making here is that if there was an easy answer to any of these complicated questions, they would have already been found.
pawras
Stallion
Yeah 2 for the final decs if 7-11
Nothing to stop the bha from blocking sub licences like that. 3 O'briens send horses out as it is I'd treat them all as one now
I think you're putting too much faith in others, it is straight forward and not complicated with a short clear set of rules, it is just that the bha etc would rather sit on their hands doing fk all
Nothing to stop the bha from blocking sub licences like that. 3 O'briens send horses out as it is I'd treat them all as one now
I think you're putting too much faith in others, it is straight forward and not complicated with a short clear set of rules, it is just that the bha etc would rather sit on their hands doing fk all
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Still a really good race and day of betting I thought, I enjoyed it. Glad to see Broadway Boy is ok, nasty fall that, and he was running well @ 66/1, I thought he'd be poor so I didn't have him, was getting worried he'd win it at one point. My biggest bet was Stumptown which was naff (& I had I Am Maximus), but I did have Nick Rockett, I just wish I had more on it, my mum had it, and I watched the morning show and saw him rolling around in the grass so I had to have something on him, should have been my biggest bet after that really, plus I should have done a combination forecast, I keep forgetting about that type of bet, never mind eh, profit for the day, but only enough for a takeaway.
markfinn
Sire
Nothing to stop them - other than perhaps having the Kudos of a certain trainers name , for the Turf Breading is all important so multiple horses from certain owners is going to all be a situation that will occur - its difficult for sure but I for one will continue to ignore such races , who cares ? no one but it tarnishes the game when you know that the the best races are being targeted in this way - Straying from yesterdays race but with multiple horse working together its difficult for others to compete fairly - one on one can not box another one in, on the other hand what about pace makers ? is that also fair