Raceform Interactive.

[USFIGS]

I am struggling with race ratings/figures. I can't find anything that sort of rating comparable to Timeform, Racing Post, Beyer speed figures, etc. like I am used to in the states. I have spent many hours over the past year on international racing and have found sources for the type of data I am accustomed to for Australia, Singapore, South Africa and Korea but nothing for France. The only figures I know of are made by TheBluesBrother and I know he doesn't make them commercially available (I believed they only covered PMU tracks as well). Timeform has them for the Paris tracks but that's it. I got as far as making what I think is a good set of race pars (average winning figures for each class) for France but pars are just that, averages. It doesn't tell me enough about the specific race I am trying to rate. Some are obviously worse than the class average, and some better. Final time on its face is virtually useless because of the way races are run and because the state of the ground can vary so dramatically. Not to mention the French lie about it as well.

Believe it or not, I have been working on this for 5 years now...

 

[TheBluesBrother]

USFIGS

Hi Ian, these days I only work on the odd French race, I am only really interested in British 2yo's that run in French group races.
I still produced the speed figures for all the English and Irish racing scene and update my lists daily for both the flat and national hunt, they are freely available here.

Flat: AW2018_2019.xlsx

NH: NH2018_2019.xlsx

Mike.

 

[USFIGS]

Thanks very much Mike. I am trying to come up with an automated way to make a race rating (which would then be used to rate all the other horses in the race) by starting with a race "par" or average for the class. I actually have pretty good par figures, e.g. using a TF scale the average winning rating by class in France is:

GRP 1 125
GRP 2 115
GRP 3 111

A 103
B 99
C 92
etc.

The problem, of course is that while the average Class C winning rating is 92 some very good races will be won with 100, and some bad races will be won with an 80. How does one adjust the par to more accurately reflect the specific race in question. Final time would be a good place to start in many countries but there are few truly run races and the ground in France is so variable plus the track conditions are frequently made up... what's a mother to do?

I really am surprised no one makes and sells such figures. They are, for example, available in Australia even if the data does costs 1000 euros a month...

Thanks all!

Ian

 

[TheBluesBrother]

I am trying to come up with an automated way to make a race rating

Because of the extremes of going we have in the British isles and the different variables I use to compile my speed figures, automation would not work in my case.

To give you an example of why automation would be difficult in this country, the race distances are not constant due to the rail movements, an example from the recent Fakenham NH meeting.



I have attached my own class pars table.

Mike.

 

[USFIGS]

Mike, your British pars are similar to what I worked out when I was working on French pars so I am pretty sure my pars are decent. I've made pars in the states for 40 years so France isn't my first rodeo, LOL. I just haven't been able to make any figures that have held up in France. The last ones I made started with a class par and then made adjustments to the race rating for how spread out the field was at the finish. It ignored the final time since it seems meaningless in France. From that I made adjustments to indivudal horses according to how far they were beaten and how much weight they carried relative to scale. Those figures turned out to not be predicative under exhaustive test conditions. I am stumped right now on how to do it better.

Very interesting conversation. I always enjoy bouncing things off of you and rpjd99 .

 

[markfinn]

J justmyluck1 I only use the flat version which costs £47 per month and imo this represents excellent value. As far as i am aware Raceform do not do a Proform type Youtube demo which is a shame. All i can advise is that it best suits my way of working which is to identify a horse of interest via my own ratings and then investigate all of its past form.

I find the way they present a race and the options available for investigating individual runners straight forward and most helpful. The IT support is first class and genuinely available 7 days per week which for a computer numpty such as myself also counts for plenty on the rare occasions that the product plays up.

Re demo i found this which is 10yrs old and does not do justice to the product but what's good for the Gosden .

Got it

 

[mick]

Got it

Good that video is dated now and although not many new aspects have been added the screen presentation is now sharper.