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Ante Post in general

mick

Sire
Defiantly a Marmite means of investing but over the years some of my very best and worst memory's have come from same. While i am not aware of having any masochistic tendencies there can be an almost perverted pleasure involved when having placed your bet you then feel the need to constantly scan the press and Dec stages , will i get a run will the weights be raised or will the going or draw sabotage the wager. But on the occasions when come the 48hr decs all is sweet there is no finer feeling than to be holding a voucher @ 33/1 for an animal the market is now calling a 10/1 shot. Well perhaps one when some of them actually oblige by winning.

I do not bet on the NH so while waiting for turf flat AP opportunities i thought i would contribute to the thread by recalling some of my above and will start with two sides of the coin from one of my fav races The Cambridgeshire. It was 34yrs ago when Dallas won but i still cringe when recalling because i had an elderly betting shop mate whose nephew made the grade as a jockey. He also bet and left a tank with his uncle and we placed his money.

A few days prior to the race he asked us to put a fair wedge on Dallas @ 14/1 and we went round the shops and got this done. Uncle Harry followed in but having looked at the race i concluded that Dallas a 3yo with a big weight could not win so had nothing on for myself. On the Monday as we drove back round the shops collecting a bag full of cash i received ever increasing amounts of stick from Harry. !

A more recent and happier recollection was when Spark Plug won the 2016 running. Although its none of my business i have a thing about horses names and when he first started running i recall thinking not a positive or kind name for a race horse. But when the entries where published i worked the race and concluded that off my ratings and profiling Sparkie had the makings so when the AP market went up i started backing him at 33/1.

At the 48hr decs he was declared to run with the rider i was hoping for shown as booked, but matters then started to take a turn for the worst because an Indian Autumn meant the ground was Fc G-F and i wanted good. On the morning of the race this was changed to Firm in places something we seldom see at Newm and the swear box then received a good earn when the course clerk announced that they had not watered over night because a heavy dew was fc which did not occur.!

By this time Sparkie was 12/1 but Tbh i was feeling very negative about his prospects and had mentally accepted that my money was done, but no one told the horse that the ground was to fast because he won by 2lens giving me a very good pay day indeed.

Anyway that's a couple of my AP tales and i would love to read some of yours. :)
 

markfinn

Sire
I only have one - Carrol House for the Arc backed it purely on a Sporting Life front page headline ( that's where I was when starting out - never read press opinion these days) - backed it 28/1 and kept on nibbling although from memory the worst was ever 22/1 - we went to Paris and smashed it in Paris telling all those around us - hotel staff - taxi drivers - anyway she obliged and it was a Stella (not a typo) weekend and even better home coming collecting money from all the town.

Perhaps I should read more press stuff
 
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mick

Sire
Pain and pleasure : The Bunbury Cup has long been one of my fav races years ago it used to be run mid week but in recent times they have switched it to Saturday. I do not follow horses as such but in the spring of 2012 after a good 2nd in the Victoria Cup i noted Bonnie Brae as a possible for the Bunbury and on the Monday preceding the race B365 went up AP @ 25/1 which caused a double take and a check of the weather Fcs because any soft would be a positive. These predicted heavy rain and i filled my boots.

Come the day the ground went soft and she went off @ 13/2 and won nicely. But so often there is a price to pay in this case two. At the time i had no TV in my upstairs study preferring to listen to the on line commentary and just on the off my bloody internet went down. As i ran down the stairs to reach the lounge TV i tripped a good - un going A over T and spraining my ankle, but i still managed to get the TV on in time to see Bonnie do the business.

What was the second price ? soon after i received the Dear John e mail from B365. !
 

Outlander

Gelding
Again the Cambridgeshire early nineties I was always going racing and never missed a meeting at my local track, I remember Rambos Hall turning up in classier type claiming races after being absent for a couple of years since previously winning the Cambridgeshire( I believe now that the horse was sold to US and came back, at the time I didn’t know and thought it had been injured), he won one of these claimers and I remember saying to a friend that I had enough money to claim him (abt 20k l had saved after a few years successful punting) but as a 19yo with a crap job getting about £150 a week I would be left to skint to pay training fees, I said it was the bargain of a lifetime and he would win the Cambridgeshire again if he stayed sound, I got 40/1 from my local independent bookie and had £50 on. Then the horse turned up again in another claimer at Haydock and won again I think the price tag was abt 27k, on his next run I think we all backed him heavily when he won a Ascot handicap, then next it was the Cambridgeshire on the morning of the race the best price was 7/1 I told everyone I knew to have a good bet I had £250 on at 7/1 and I fancied Subotica for the Arc the next day and he was best priced 16/1 so I had a £50 double as well, Rambos routed them in the Cambridgeshire and Subotica followed up the next day, still be biggest pre-race payout I’ve ever achieved and a day I will never forget..

On the negative side I remember watching Barton Bank win a small novice chase I think at Worcester and I backed him for the Sun Alliance at Cheltenham, I thought he was a magnificent jumper and a beautiful looking chaser, I kept backing him all the way up to the race and still to this day I’ve never had that much money on a horse, I was at Cheltenham to watch and saw him pull up and walk past me near the rail with blood coming from his nostrils, he had broken blood vessels and his race was over, I did recoup most of the loses when I backed him to win the Charlie hall at big odds on his comeback I think the next season, he also I remember slammed Young Hustler (the horse who won the Sun Alliance in another Charlie Hall win), I remember being absolutely devastated when he pulled up that day because I’ve never been that confident a horse would win.
 

mick

Sire
mick mick markfinn markfinnthe sweet ones float to the top. One of the advantages of the passing years.
Another being recalling the sweet ones can prove helpful during the periods when things are not going to plan. :) One of our members sometimes mentions HOF Hall Of Fame when someone writes up a big priced winner. I have my own version WOF Wall Of Fame which is framed pictures ( in front of me now) of horses winning which gave me extra good pay days..........Many are from long ago but live in hope Re future additions.

The late and imo great trainer Bill Wightman described it well when calling his book Months of Misery, Moments of Bliss. Talking of which i have a fond and funny memory which comes from backing his Import ante post to win the Wokingham. This would have been > 40yrs ago but i can still recall the details and at my age i guess i should feel grateful for this. !
 
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markfinn

Sire
Not an ante post bet but post post story - when younger ( a lot younger) I was at Wetherby and race preceding my interest was the auction race - it romped so thought I would go and watch the auction with a view - anyway it was being led around and the speil is flying about this next Cheltenham hopeful, when the poor horse keeled over and died - there was this poor woman in torrents of tears, it was a bit distressing to see this winning lump of horse flesh just go without signs of distress.
Talk about a near escape - but it was quite educational to watch the authorities in action -the lady was consoled , the barriers went around the horse quick style and whilst my race was on I watched it being dragged into the knacker van by means of a steel braided cable - not quite the return journey the owners had in mind.
 

markfinn

Sire
I was out last and someone mentioned an old friend sadly no longer with us - "Paddy" was backing Little Polvier to win the G National 3 years before it ever did it - it cost him shed loads but he never lost faith and thankfully he was proved right in the end.
He was so clued up about the horses and could talk for ever about the subject, he loved the craic -his holidays were centred entirely around Cheltenhan Week and G National week.
Just a nice bloke went to soon early in his late 40's but at least he got to cheer L Polvier home in the big one.
 

The Uncouth

Gelding
I would never again bet ante post weeks and months before a race.
There is just too much that can go wrong until the time of your race.

A few years ago I went ante post at Cheltenham when as usual certain people were talking of horses that couldn't be beat and I took that advice weeks before the race.
The ground changed, there was a jockey change on another, there was one horse that did not run and another who ran in a different race at a different racing distance and what I thought against tougher opposition.
I lost.


But I learnt so much from that expensive experience...

I listen to others tip information, but I do a thorough check on it myself and I must be 100% in agreement with that tipster before I wager.

I have never bet blind since.

I place a bet the day before a race, possibly 2 but never a period greater.

Even if Frankel was still running and I was given free money to place a bet on him in a race months ahead, I still wouldn't do it.
I detest ante post with a passion....can you tell? haha.


That expensive experience I cursed at the time, looking back I now see it as a blessing.
 

mick

Sire
The Uncouth The Uncouth i certainly get your above. Years ago the Ante post markets for races like The Lincoln used to be a big deal with lots of press coverage and punter interest from Feb >. But i experienced the downside when backing three N/r on the trot and for many years then swerved. It was my Bonnie Brae bet mentioned above which kick started my resumption.

A lot will depend on our risk mentality but mine is that when you secure 25/1 for 13/2 winners then longer term there is a margin for error and disappointment. The other positive from my perspective is that Chelt aside i suspect that Ante Post wagering is not as popular as back in the day and this can be the very time to start taking an interest.

You mentioned months and weeks but three days prior to the race you are still betting on AP terms with a much better insight Re the likely going and i have found there is still good value to be nicked even at this stage, and no bloody R4s to worry about.
 

The Uncouth

Gelding
I get you mick mick
I totally understand getting the 25/1 value on a horse who will be much skinnier closer to the day, but I have learnt especially at Cheltenham on the day you can get much better value (not favourites).

I think every punter is a risk taker, but I think you must have balls of absolute steel to go ante post so far ahead....
 

Chesham

Sire
I have had the odd ante post, two that spring to mind was Slip Anchor in the Derby, the great Steve Cauthen who knew how to set the fractions , must have had a clock in his head.

One that went astray and a load of my neighbours were asking me about the Grand National and my advice was to get on West Tip, ante post . The first time I topped up my bets in the weeks leading up to the GN and If I remember correctly myself and the neighbours Would have had some party if it had paid off. On the day of the race they were all at my house and I had brewed some extra strong lager for the day and we were well into,the pre race build up. At each fence we cheered until West Tip had its legs knocked from underneath him by a faller and stood no chance of recovery.

The next year West Tip won

Maori Venture was another successful one .

One that was not from my analysis but my local butcher (Arthur) who purchased his meat off the hoof (that’s what he called it) was always at the cattle auctions and mixed with those in Know and had a Good knowledge of what Martin Tate was planning and he gave me some nice touches. One that springs to mind was Von Trappe who landed some nice bets at the Cheltenham festival that year .
One thing about Arthur he did not place money on a horse unless it was a decent price and he knew that the information was 100% solid. Arthur Was a 3rd generation butcher and was brought up the hard way with regards work ethics and money. I once asked him where he went for his holidays and he replied I don’t need to go anywhere, every day is a holiday for me in this shop. When I first moved in the village I was a student and he always put me straight on what was the best meat to buy cheaply and how to cook it to get the best result. I’m sure he gave me more than My moneys worth as it always seemed such a low price when I paid . He was a true gentleman, his wife was more like Annie Walker out of coronation street and totally different to Arthur .

These days I would not bet Antepost as I think today’s inbreeding has produced too many that don’t stand up to the rigours of racing. Not too many store horses with the NH. Although a few can be spotted if one looks at the pedigree and mlmrob mlmrob has a keen eye for those coming from the PTP scene and he has opened my eyes to the opportunities from that angle.
 

mick

Sire
Chesham Chesham although i was not on either i do well recall the GN and Derby wins you mention. :) I also recall that back in those days you could go in the shops or by phone and ask for £100 @ 20/1 in a big race without any fuss or bother. !
 
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Chesham

Sire
Chesham Chesham although i was not on either i do well recall the GN and Derby wins you mention. :) I also recall that back in those days you could go in the shops or by phone and ask for £100 @ 20/1 in a big race without any fuss or bother. !
I used to use Corals back in those days and the Staff were really friendly and the shop was always packed when Racing was coming through the blower and they had someone chalking up the live prices

If at home checking the results via teletext .

Maori Venture paid for a a new Double bed and also got me 2nd place in the Pubs Saturday Naps Competition which ran for a 3 month period. It gave me an excuse to go in the pub for a cheeky one on a Saturday lunch time to enter My Nap.

Happy Days from a Racing perspective. For NH Racing I always liked Superform (Paper Version)

In the 90’s I did mostly Match Betting with Sporting Index , mostly Flat, Grp and Listed over 12f as I could use Pedigree knowledge with the younger 3 Y-O to see which o e of the two horses that the index listed had the most stamina for the distance . You either Bought or sold the Lengths

My account was a telephone one and you spoke to a Trader who would tel, you the Current Match Lengths with regards the Spread for the match .
One downside was that if you got it wrong it was the Lengths X Your Stake that was debited from your bank account. I did well at it , but eventually got annoyed with seeing a jockey who was in front ease the horse down to showboat and this often reduced my payout , as Exmples it was 12 lengths maximum payout and quite often a decent horse with stamina could have put hat distance between the match, but if the jockey showboated the actual distance could be reduced from what it would have been without the showboating.

The nice thing with Match Betting was that it did not matter if your horse did not win as long as it finished better than the horse that you had bought lengths against .

the other good part was that you did not pay tax and the Firm never closed or restricted accounts as their profit was locked into the Spread, in effect you were buying you really taking an opposite view to another spread bettor .

I have never seen anyone doing horse racing Match Bets on any of the forums that I have been on.
 
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